Overall crime in Asheville has decreased 22 percent, but violent crime continues to be “higher,” the city’s top two police officials — citing recent data — told the Asheville-based Council of Independent Business Owners on Aug. 4 in UNC Asheville’s Sherrill Center.

However, the good news on the overall crime decline was tempered by words of caution that there is a high-probability of underreporting of minor crimes in the city because the public is well-aware of the severely understaffed Ashevlle Police Department — and its resulting inability to follow up.

The two police officials providing the APD update were Police Chief David Zack and Deputy Chief Mike Lamb. After their 18-minute report, they fielded questions from the CIBO meeting attendees for about 12 minutes.

Among the estimated 75 people in attendence were U.S. Rep. Chuck Edwards, R-Henderson County; and Woodfin Mayor Jerry VeHaun, both of whom were recognized by CIBO President Buzzy Cannady, who served as the meeting master of ceremonies.

Immediately prior to the update by Zack and Lamb, Cannady congratulated Lamb on his recent promotion to “deputy chief,” the APD’s second-highest post.

After thanking Cannady for his recognition, Lamb, who gave his share of the update first, said, “We (Asheville) currently are down in overall crime by 22 percent. The problem is, looking at a five-year window, we still are very high.

“Also,” Lamb stressed, “looking at aggravated assaults, arson and common law — not armed — robberies, it’s still slightly higher....”

After a pause, he added, “I also say that, with a caveat, we know there is underreporting out there, as everyone knows our staffing level (at the APD) is down,” so an unknown percentage of minor crime victims in Asheville would view reporting such crimes as pointless.

Further, the deputy chief asserted, “We’ve had help from stakeholders downtown, which has helped with (reducing) crime in the central business district.”

In concluding, Lamb said, “The (overall) crime (in Asheville) is tracking downward, but it’s still too early to say” if the trend will continue. “We’re hoping this downward trend in crime downtown continues to track downward... And we’re hoping — in the future — we’re able to increase our staff, because we’ve seen that more (police) officers helps to reduce crime.”

Next, Zack, the police chief, addressed the CIBO crowd, noting, “To reinforce what Deputy Chief Lamb said, it’s not necessarily a year-to-year thing, but to look at where a city’s going, you take a five-year or a 10-year snapshot...

“Yeah, the worst we expected would be to see record (violent) crime dropped. I’d love to get up here and say, ‘I made crime stop.’”

Zack added, “Incapacitation works — when we take really bad people off the street, crime will go down.” To that end, he said the city has removed some of Asheville’s most troublesome repeat offenders from the city’s streets.

“As far as recruitment, the staffing situation has been steady,” the police chief said. “For a couple years now, the APD has been operating at 40 percent down in staffing.”

On the bright side, “in our recruiting, we’re seeing a lot of interest — and we’re seeing a lot of growth in applicants.”

Zack then triggered some chuckles from the meeting attendees when he added, “I caution you… there are ‘applicants’ and there are ‘qualified applicants.’”

Turning back to the APD’s staffing quandary, as violent crime continues to spike, he said, “We have 143 officers available, which keeps us down about 40 percent.”

As for the recruitment gap, Zack asserted, “That timeframe is 14 months, from the day we bring you in to fill out an application to when you’re ready to be out on the street.

“So it’s a real slow process. It still takes 14 months. So right now we’ve got five officers in field training and are set to go into the field in November 2023. We’ve got five who just started in the police academy, but they won’t be available until January 2024.”

Further, he said, “In next year’s (recruitment) class, we hope to have seven to 10 (job trainees), but they won’t be available (to work) until November 2024...

“All of last year, we only received 224 applicantions to join the APD. As of today, we’ve received 231 applicants. So we will top that” number from last year, which he termed a good sign.

Meanwhile, Zack noted, “This year, as of Sept. 1, we (the APD) will have lost 14 officers — just in 2023. Several (departures) are from retirement, one is a termination and the others decided law enforcement was not the career for them...

“We’re kind of treading water — a little bit. Recruitment is tough. We’re competing in a national marketplace. The Tennessee Highway Patrol recently did a major boost in pay, prompting other law enforcement agencies in the area to follow suit, prompting Zack to say, “It’s like an arms race!”

He added, “In Asheville, our starting pay is $47,500, with a $3,500 signing bonus... The marketplace is changing month to month — because every city in America is looking for police officers.”

In speaking of the APD’s staffing challenge, the police chief said, “What we’re faced with is a highly, highly competitive marketplace. Every time we make a gain (in compensation), the next guy over... raises his pay.”

In Zack’s assessment, “Those (police departments) who pay the highest do the best. We’re a city of 90,000 people. Can we compete?”

The police chief then noted that one other way the APD receives new employees is through lateral transfers. To that end, he added, “In eight and a half years, the APD only took in two lateral transfers. But since May of 2023, we took in six lateral transfers. So we’re seeing that interest from (employees from) some of the local (law enforcement) agencies to come over to the APD....”

Ultimately, Zack said of recruiting new officers to boost the APD, “It’s still a long game. It will take many years (to bring the staff up to the needed level) — and the only thing that speeds that up are the ‘laterals’ and the new recruits. And the new recruits are the long game — and ‘laterals’ are the short game.”

During a question-and-answer session that followed, CIBO member Mac Swicegood asked the police chief to speak a bit more about the APD’s attrition problem.

“When I came (Feb. 4, 2020 was his first day serving as the Asheville police chief), the APD already has suffered from attrition numbers,” Zack replied. “But during a couple years (2020 and 2021), we had a major loss of officers.”

(To that end, a June 4, 2021 story — headlined “Police quitting surges” — in the Asheville Citizen Times stated the following: “According to recent figures obtained by the Citizen Times, the APD officer attrition rate, formerly one per month, jumped to 7.5 per month in the four months after local protests set off by Minneapolis police murdering black resident George Floyd (who was killed by a white policement in Minneapolis, Minn., on May 25, 2020). Those figures now show that rather than dropping, attrition has remained high, at nearly six per month. That has left APD with only 167 of its 238 sworn officer positions filled, a 30 percent vacancy rate. Among those who left are detectives, whose ranks have shrunk by nearly half, according to Zack. Because of vacations and other types of leave only 148 of the 167 officers are available to work, an APD spokeswoman said.”)

Also during the CIBO Q&A, an unidentified man suggested, “It seems like you need to be looking for more ‘laterals.’” 

In response, Zack said, “When ‘laterals’ come in, they’re either looking for a better situation or they’re in trouble. You have to remember, the offiers are giving up seniority. A lot officers want to come (with their ranks) with them,” which the APD does not allow.

What’s more, the police chief asserted, “‘Laterals’ are a tricky business. They tend to be on the younger side. They’re coming to the APD” for reasons that need to be deeply examined. 

At that point, U.S. Rep. Chuck Edwards, R-Henderson County, addressed Zack and Lamb and the entire APD, noting, “We are so grateful for the service you provide, especially under such duress.” Edwards’ assertion triggered sustained applause from many in the CIBO audience.

“I’m constantly amazed by the great morale of our staff and leadership,” Zack said in response to Edwards’ remark.

Then Edwards said,  “In addition to that (his praise for the APD), I’d like to share some quick thoughts. There seem to be so many people who want to ‘slice and dice’ data to support a narrative they want to put forth.

“I’d just like to share some thoughts (that) my office hears... My office is constantly hearing from folks who say they ‘don’t feel safe in downtown Asheville.’ Another one is that we see our economy is beginning to slow down. I put the two and two together. Because they (tourists and visitors) are avoiding Asheville and Buncombe County, you can surmise that crime will be down (too).”

Edwards then praised Zack “for giving the data accurately,” despite likely heavy pressure to present a more positive spin on violent crime in Asheville. 

The congressman concluded his remarks by noting that a businessman (who he did not identify) “got a note from that his insurance that it will not be renewed” at his business in downtown Asheville because of the crime situation there.

In response to Edwards’ assertions, Zack said, “I will always, always, be accurate. That’s just how I operate. I never get too high or get too low. What I can tell you is (that) our city leaders do listen to me. When I need a resource, I’ve never been told ‘no.’ Pay is a tricky issue. When we think we’ve made significant gains, someone else jumps ahead...”

An unidentified man then asked Zack, “So you have a ‘green light’ to do what you want to do?”

“Again, salary matters and that’s behind my” efforts in trying to persuade city leaders to keep raising the salary and benefits for APD officers.

The, the man wondered “where is the money,” if instead of the budgeted 238 officers, the APD only numbers 173 officers?

“A lot of it is going into overtime” to the overworked APD officers,” the police chief answered. “Not one penny has been taken away from the APD.”

After a pause, Zack added, “One thing I’m going to stress with the city — maybe we need to stop thinking differently... Do we need to modify our (police) pay month by month?”

An unidentifed woman asked, “If I can’t get people to report (crimes), can I at least get a number to call so at least they can call” in crimes for data purposes?

“Just let me know,” Zack replied, noting that he is well-aware of violent crime fears in downtown Asheville. Specifically, he said his wife works downtown “and she asks at the end of every day, ‘When are you going to do something about downtown (crime)?” 

He added, “The reason we were able to get more offiers downtown… we were able to provide that presence” that deters crime. The feedback I got was that it’s good to see you guys (APD officers) down here (in downtown Asheville) in ‘numbers.’”

Ultimately, Zack surmised, “It’s how you feel. Public safety is a state of mind. If you feel comfortable, you know it... So our presence matters When we’re there, things (crimes) don’t happen. And when they do happen, they’re taken care of efficiently and quickly... When we’re not around, you feel less safe.

“So that’s where we’re at — trying to be a proactive force — that we’re there” when the APD is needed, Zack said in concluding the Q&A to sustained applause from the CIBO crowd.